We Live Here! Florida Community Studies Consortium

Julius Keaton Oral History Interview

Biscayne National Park

Date: 2007

Interview by Dr. Gregory Bush (GB), accompanied by Kathy Hersh (KH)

GB: You were born and raised here?

JK: No. I was born in Camila, GA. At the age of 2 and a half, we came here. Since 2 and a half I was here. I did 3 years in the Navy. After the Navy, June 20, 1975, I started working for Biscayne National Park. Actually, it was Biscayne National Monument.

GB: So you’ve been here 30 years. Let’s think back to your earliest memories of Homestead, what the neighborhood was like that you came from, and your early experiences.

JK: My earliest experience as a child…We called ourselves the Alley. It was something like 44 houses in 2 blocks. Eleven houses on one row and ten houses on the front row. Each household would have 3 to 4 kids. One bedroom houses we called “shotgun houses.” You walked straight through to the kitchen. Back in the days, the bathroom used to be on the back porch. At certain times of the night we had to take a bath, connect the back door to the screen door and to the kitchen before you got to your first bedroom.

Back then it was really wild. But it was more interesting back then because there was a lot of kids. It was a strong community. Everybody had chores to do and everybody got along great.

GB: What did your parents work at?

JK: Well, I was raised by my mother. When we first started, we did a lot of field work. Then at first she worked in a restaurant. She liked cooking and stuff so she worked in a restaurant for so many years. Afterwards, she said, “I’m going to teach you to do this and teach you to do that.” And I’m the only one she taught to do this and that. There’s five of us in the family. I’ve got two sisters and two brothers and all of them is well right now.

GB: What kind of work did you do in the fields and how young were you when you started working the fields?

JK: I first started experiencing field work when I was 5. I did the hampers on the beans. And I was, of course, called the “water boy.” Anybody that wanted water would call me “Water boy, water boy.” They would tell me what row they were in. I had the only container and I would walk and go bring them water and every day they would give me a nickel.

GB: How long did you work in the fields?

JK: I worked in the field about a year. It was time to go to first grade. Then there was no excuse, Ma. “Mom, there’s no excuse this time, I’m going to school.” So I went to school.

GB: What was school like? What did it do for you?

JK: A lot of kids that you could play with, learn from, meet different families. Then after school it was real fun. Everybody walking home from school, laughing and joking and playing tag. You knew you had to go home. At the end of the day you didn’t want to go home because once you’re home you had your chores to do, your homework to do.

GB: How would you describe race relations when you were growing up in the late 50’s, early 60’s?

JK: Well, race relations didn’t hit us until the 60’s, mid-60’s.

GB: Were there ugly incidents that you remember as a kid.

JK: I was in my own little world as a child. We could only go out of the yard if we asked to go out of the yard. We couldn’t go across the street until we asked to go across the street. We were isolated. Mom was God or King. It was Mom’s rule. Before you did anything you had to get Mom’s permission. And that’s the way it went.

GB: So basically, your life as a child was almost exclusively within the African American community. What church did you go to?

JK; Back then we went to Shiloh Missionary Baptist Church. You had to go to church on Sundays. That was the way they was brought up so that’s the way they tried to put it into you. We used to play hooky from church. They used to see us in church, put all our money on the table, and walk right out the door.

GB: Where there many parks in town that you could go to?

JK: Well we had this one, Roby George Park, that still exists in Homestead. That was the closest to our house and that’s where we went. Once we left the school, Roby George was the closest park to our house and it was something like five blocks. We were allowed to go to Roby George and play and but we had to be home before 9 o clock.

GB: And the parks were segregated?

JK: We didn’t have but one black park in our community.

When I was coming up we just lived in our community. Only time we went outside our community was when we were going to the store and that’s when we ran into these segregation problems.

My first experience was when we went to Army Navy. My brother and me we picked limes all week and then we had enough money we figured to go and buy what we needed. Then the incident happened.

We walked to the store. And there was a pick up truck with kids. And their dog and all. Because they was Alabama plates. That’s the first time we heard that “N” word. “Nigger, we’re going to sic our dog on you and what you going to do about it?” And we said, “Tell you what. You come into the store and we’ll show you.” We couldn’t fight them outside because of the dog.

But when they came inside. It was all a different story. We did some damage to the people’s property and stuff. And we got called the “n” word again. You N so and so…..” That’s my first experience.

GB: How old were you?

JK: 13.

GB: When was the first time you came out here?

JK: The first time we came out I was about eight.

GB: Do you remember the first time you came?

JK: Yeah, you know it, because that’s the first time I saw what you call the ocean. First time I saw that bay out there we thought it was the ocean. We saw little crabs on the ground and we said, “Man, we’re by the ocean.”

GB: So you were eight years old when you first came out here. Very interesting. Mostly because it was difficult to get around, you were in your community, your mother was working, you didn’t have transportation, I’m guessing….

JK: Well, you know, a lot of black people don’t like to swim. And when they fish, they fish with a cane pole. So the water is the last thing on their mind, especially when they come out in this area.

All the mans will try first. The guys will come out and leave their wives at home. And then they’ll try to get their wives out. And they’ll say, “No, you go and take the kids.” A lot of black women don’t like the water. They bathe in it and all that good stuff but they don’t like being around it.

GB: What was it like when you first came here what did you see and can you describe the area a little bit?

JK: When I first saw it I saw all the beautiful sand and the water and the surrounding itself. Like there was a dance floor. And people were out there dancing, man, look at that. That was an experience when you saw a group of people dancing back in those days. And the way they was dancing and “I don’t know how to dance, man,” and “look at the way they do it, what they doing?” Different dances back in the day. You ran to the floor and you stood there and watched, man, and you watched and you say, “yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.” That’s how you get your experience. I can’t hardly put that in words. Oh man, what can I say.

GB: Was it a juke box, the music, or live music?

JK: No. They had a juke box.

Juke box you flipped through and punched the 5j or 5a or whatever and then the music would come on. It would be on.

GB: All day and into the night?

JK: Well, we only came after church. We’d come here for a certain hour. We’d get here and wait on our great aunts and different cousins. Once they got out then we were allowed. We weren’t allowed to come to the water until all the elderlies say, “Ok, it’s fine, you all can go to the water.” They get out of the car and we had to stay in the car until they got out of the car and say, “Ok, you all can get out of the car.” There’s the beach and run? No, no, whatever they say, that’s what went.

GB: Did you learn to swim here?

JK: No. I learned to swim at the Blue. What we called “The Blue.” We played hooky one day and we went swimming. I jumped in the water and didn’t know how to swim. The dude named Jeff, Jeff Jefferson, saved me. He said, “What are you doing little boy? You don’t even know how to swim? What you think you can walk on water or stuff like that?” I said, “No, I didn’t know it was that deep.” He say, “Where are you from?” I say, “I’m from the Alley.” He say, “Whose your Mama?” And I told him my ma. He said, “If I let anything happen to you, Miss _____ would never forgive us. We going to teach you how to swim.” I say “Okay.” He say, “First of all you hold onto this cable and you kick your feet. Don’t let go until I tell you to let go. I said, “Okay.” I let go and went under water. He said, “I didn’t tell you to let go. Listen to me, I’m going to teach you how to swim.” I said, “Okay.” He said, “First you got to learn how to hold your breath under water. Duck your head under the water.” I say, “Okay.” “Then kick your feet, kick your feet, kick your feet and don’t let this cable go.” I say, “Okay, okay.” He say, “I’m going to take you to the shallow end where you can stand up and walk and I’m going to teach you how to swim.” So it was the deep part of the Blue and the shallow part of the Blue. He took me to the shallow part, until it was way deep, and then he taught me how to swim. I didn’t know how to swim. I jumped in the water cause I thought I could do that.

I took water very seriously after that.

We played hooky. I remember we were in the 4th grade. And we played hooky. We were like Lloyd Bridges. That was our favorite show. Our favorite show. Before we played hooky, we stopped by the store. We put this quarter in and got a little knife out. We got down there and there was this old lady fishing. “Hey boys, y’all know you’re supposed to be in school today.” We told the old lady, “There ain’t no school today, m’am. There ain’t no school. “You sure of that, boys?” “Yes, m’am.”

We told a fibbie. Okay? So we got to this certain area, we dove in the water. We were loving every minute of it. And then Anthony say, “I’m Lloyd Bridges and we’re going to play Sea Hunt.” Okay. Ray: “I’m the bad guy and we’re going to fight under water.” I say, “Okay, well, I’m going to watch you all fight underwater. I’m going to stay on top.” So Anthony stuck hisself, with the little knife, he stuck hisself. And he saw the blood and he passed out. So Ray was down there with him. Ray came up, got his clothes, started running. I say “What are you doing, what are you doing?” I say, “come on back here!” “No, he’s dead, he’s dead.” I say “No he’s not dead, he’s bleeding, he’s bleeding, he’s bleeding.” I say, “We have to go get him, we have to go get him. We can’t leave him down there. No, no, no.” I said, “Listen, we’ve got to go get him.” So we held on to the cable. We got him, brung him up. Turned him on his stomach. Do CPR. We said, “Whatever we do we can’t let him see his cut. We didn’t know he was scared of his own blood. He came to and he said, “What happened, what happened?” I said, “Remember you all was playing with a knife and you stuck yourself.” “No, I didn’t, I didn’t.” I said “yes you did,” and Ray said “yes, you did.” And he said, “No, I didn’t.” And Ray said, “Yes, you did. I’ve got proof. He lift up, saw the blood. Passed out again. I said, “Don’t do that. We’ve got to keep it covered. We got to tie it up. We got to go find us some spider web.” So we found some spider web and old rag. We got a bunch of spider web together and put it on and we tied it. We couldn’t let him see it. Then the little old lady said, “I told you boys, you know y’all playing hooky from school.” Oh man, we’re in trouble now. We didn’t think nothing of it.

We got home. Me and my cousin was in the same class room. She copied the questions off the board. Plain out busted. By then, my mama had walked up and heard her. She said, “Where your books at?” I said, “My books under the house.” She said, “Your books under the house? Go get ‘em.” Oh, law. Oh, law.

GB: You never did that again?

JK: No, I never played hooky no more until the 10th grade. I got caught again in the 10th grade. After that I never played hooky no more. I said, “It ain’t worth it. It ain’t worth it.”

GB: How often would you come out here [to the black beach]?

JK: We used to come out every Sunday after church. We good. Did the yacht tours on Saturday. Then my great aunt: “We’re going to the beach. We’re going to the beach.” And I’d go, “Oh, man, we’re going to the beach. We’re going to the beach.”

My great aunt used to pick us up because she had a station wagon. A Fairlane Ford station wagon. Remember them Fairlanes?

Yeah. We’d come out to the beach.

GB: What else would you do? Picnic?

Dance, and swim. Right. Picnic, dance, and swim. And eat. We ate. Oooh. We’d wait for my great aunt to come from Miami. She’d fry that special corn bread on top of the stove with onions and stuff in them. Oh, god.

GB: So they had cook out pits here?

JK: Back in the days? No, you brung your own food. A lot of the elderlies cooked the food on Sundays and transferred it out here. They had a picnic basket.

GB: Where there any kind of religious services out here?

JK: Baptism. Be a lot of baptism out here. A lot of baptism.

GB: What about going up to Virginia Key? Did you go up there very often?

JK: Not that often but we went cause we had other relatives and we’d say well, we’re going to meet together at so and so at a certain time. And we went to Virginia Key.

GB: What was that like?

JK: It was different all together because what you do, when you go over that little bridge with all that water beneath you, you go, “Man, I hope this bridge doesn’t collapse.” That’s the first thing on your mind. You hope it don’t collapse. Because you ain’t never been on a bridge that long. As a matter of fact, I ain’t never been on a bridge that long. Hope it don’t collapse. But

once we got over there it was nice. Very nice.

GB: Were there a lot of concession stands, a dance floor there?

JK: Yeah. They had stuff more different from what we had. They had a little train that went around. Stuff like that.

GB: So it was more of a city experience?

JK: Right. It was. It was. It sure was.

GB: How often would you go up to Miami? And what was that like to leave Homestead, the small town and go to Miami?

JK: It was different. You’re looking up and you’re like “Look at that tall building. Oh man. It was very different. You could walk into a store, especially when your mama bargain. [Unintelligible]

GB: How would you go up there? Would you go by car?

JK: Bus.

GB: Did you take any journeys into the Everglades to go fishing?

JK: Back in the days, we always went [Highway] 41. We always went 41. That was a favorite fishing spot on The Trail. The Trail was a favorite fishing spot. That’s were we always went to fish.

GB: Early on Saturdays?

JK: Early Saturday morning. We’re talking about 5 o clock in the morning. We stayed from five to five. That was a must. If go with my great aunt, five o clock we’re leaving the house, five o clock we’re leaving the fish creek. Everything was by 5 o’clock.

GB: What else would you do while you were there?

JK: We’d play tag, hide and seek. Stuff like that. We was not allowed to go close to the road. We was not allowed to go close to the water. So we had various spaces that we had to work with.

GB: How many people would be there, your whole family?

JK: It’d be about 5 or 6 different families. Friends. We’d gather a lot of wood for the fire because we used to always fry fish. If they caught it, they’d fry it right there on the creek. Fresh fried fish. Fresh cooked what you call cornbread right there on the skillet. And coffee. The problem is the coffee thing. My great aunt used to make this coffee that’s ooooh the aroma oooh. At a certain spot on the trail, you sit right here, and they’d put it there, another there and another there, the coffee pot. And when they opened that coffee pot, you dropped that pole and you dashed back to there. All the elderly girls sitting around drinking that coffee and then you asked for coffee and you know what come out of their mouth? Coffee make you black. Shouldn’t drink coffee. Coffee make you black. What? Coffee make you black. You heard me. Coffee make you black. Look at us. Look at us. They didn’t want to give it up. We got used to it. So every time they opened that coffee pot up, we might as well sit here. You might as well sit it. You don’t need to run down there. You know you ain’t going to get none.

GB: Did you wander into the Glades at all? Obviously, see alligators? I’m wondering about your relationship to the nature of the Everglades.

JK: The nature of the Everglades…Back in the days we used to go pick what we you called ________. We used to go pick beans, pole beans. Back in the days. The pole beans back in the Everglades used to get that wide. (Indicates with finger.) The pole beans used to get that wide. We used to see rattlesnakes about that big around (holds up arms), 16 or 17 feet.

GB: Not any more…

JK: Not any more. Back in the days them old girls used to pack in their apron [carry a weapon]. If you’re out in the bean field, them old girls packing. Anything move around them gets shot.

GB: Was there much hunting?

JK: For us, we did a little rabbit hunting with sticks. We run along the tractor was trenching and the rabbit would run out of his hole. We hit him with a stick. Pick em up. And run.

We had this one family named Rabbit. Their last name was Crayber (?) but we gave them the name Rabbit because on Saturday they would average125 rabbits.

GB: What about bird life?

JK: Yeah. We shot robins, church birds, the sparrows, we used to call church birds. We cooked a lot of birds when we was coming up. We killed them, cleaned them, put them on a stick and put them on the fire.

GB: Were they wild areas or cleared areas [where the planting was]?

JK: Back then the farmers before they did anything would plow everything over before they’d start producing beans and all the good stuff. That section was called R.E (?) because they produced the biggest beans.

GB: Did you go up to the Redland area and look at a lot of the different farms or work up there in later years?

JK: In the Redlands they used to have a lot of chicken farms and we used to go buy chickens. Twenty five cents for al whole chicken and stuff like that. It was a lot of chicken farms back in the days. A lot of people survived off the chicken farms. A lot of people worked on the chicken farms. But we did a lot of field work.

GB: Even as teenagers. You said you just worked in the fields one year as a kid.

JK: Yeah. As a teenager, I didn’t want to do it. But back then they had a machine called a bull hogging which separated the big plants from the small plants from the big plants, like tomatoes. Back in the days, we used to do that. Yes, we did.

GB: I want to go back to the Everglades just for a minute. How far over would you go? Would you ever go all the way over to the west coast?

JK: No. Actually, once we leave the Everglades entrance gate, we’d go something like ten miles, maybe eleven miles back to a certain area where this farmer has this crop of beans and stuff like that.

GB: What about running into native peoples?

JK: We ran into a lot of them on the trail, while we were fishing and stuff like that. We used to watch these individuals dive from the tree and come up with a fish. We got to introduced to frog legs, a lot of stuff like alligator tail, stuff like that.

GB: Did you get to know them pretty well?

JK: Just to seem them. We spoke to them.

Back in the days, my aunt say, if you speak to everybody, they don’t speak to you back, just be polite and move on. That’s the way it was.

GB: Let me take you back to your high school days. What did you do? You played football, as I recall. And there was an incident at the school?

JK: Yeah. The first race riot I was ever in. It was April 11, 1970. It started in detention. Well, actually it started in study hall, east side of South Dade High School. And then they just brung it down the hall. It was a boy and a girl, a black girl and a white boy named Len (?) Graham got into it over and incident and it started from there. Once it started, it started.

GB: Fists?

JK: Oh firsts and the whole nine yards. I remember Ingrams, a nursery right next to the high school. The boys walked the hall. They came out with guns. Oh, it got ugly then. Very ugly. We were all standing in the hall way and then all of a sudden you see guys coming with guns. We freaked out and tried to run inside but the door was locked. What are we going to do? We tried to go into home economics and it was locked. We got to get out of here some kind of way. We ran into the office.

GB: How did it finally end?

JK: It ended on a bad note. Because everybody that was on camera had to go to jail on the weekend. Everybody that fought or think about fighting in the rooms, or whatever, anybody that was on film, had to go to jail on the weekend. The bus would come at school on Fridays, pick you up after class and drop you back on Sunday afternoon.

GB: Did they catch you on camera?

JK: They had my shirt on camera. They didn’t have my face on camera because I was short.

I took this banlon [shirt] and set it on fire. [?] Actually, they caught me with this big fullback, starting fullback, named Benny Holmes. They caught me and him up on the second floor in typing. We went in the typing room. We locked one door, we left one open. I was by the light switch. He say get them to come in here, get them to come in here. They did. A typewriter in each hand. He did some damage. He say, hit the light switch and boom [brings hands together]. Turn the light switch on. Turn the light switch off. Buh, buh, boom.

GB: How do you explain how the climate had gotten so bad? The civil rights movement, etc..How did you respond to some of those outside stimuli or was it really local stuff?

JK: Well, local stuff, we didn’t actually get into politics. But what really set it off was when Kennedy got assassinated. That throwed everything off. We go, “The world’s not fair. It’s not equal. Why did they want to that to him?” I think I was in the fourth grade, something like that, when Kennedy got shot and it ain’t been the same since. The world is not right if they shoot him. Why they assassinate him? It didn’t make no sense. Somebody wanted him out and they hired somebody to do it. And they found out later, it was somebody. They wanted him out. And that’s the way it is.

GB: So you didn’t empathize or feel that close to Lyndon Johnson as President?

JK: No.

GB: More Kennedy?

JK: Yeah, Kennedy, we hooked [?} on Kennedy.

GB: What about Martin Luther King, 5 years later?

JK: Oh, man, it was sad.

BG: Do you remember that day and night?

JK: Oh, yeah. Everybody started crying. Why they do that to him? It was called for, and all that stuff. In other words, a black man gets shot for what reason? He’s not into power. He was into religion and freedom of speech, and they didn’t accept that because he was a black man so they killed him.

GB: Some have asked about Miami and why Miami didn’t have more race riots in 1967 and 1968, which they didn’t by and large like Detroit and Newark did. Here in Homestead, you have a significant riot in 1970….

JK: Well the riot started in school over an incident which shouldn’t have occurred anyway. Because this young lady ran for homecoming queen and won and the idea of it, she was a black girl. A black girl at a white school. And that’s what kicked it off. In other words, came in and took over. And we don’t like that. And we can do something about it. And that’s what happened.

KH: Sounds like you went wild in school, like there was nobody around. Did the students take over the school?

JK: Actually, they did. The teachers went into the teachers’ lounge and locked themselves in. After that they brung in different principals from different areas, the “bad” principals, the bad guys, they brung in. And after that, that’s when they started with security. Before that there was never no security in school. There was always a hall monitor but no security. So after that riot, they brung in security. What you see now, all the security in school, it didn’t start until after the 1970 riot.

GB: So between 1970 when you got out of school and 1975 when you came to work here, you were in the Navy at that point?

JK: June 11, 1971, I graduated from South Dade. I hung around the house another 2 -3 months. August 1st, I went into the Navy. I was getting away from my mom. It was time to go do something different. Mom had called all the shots all these years. Now it’s time for you to do your thing. So I went into the Navy for three years.

GB: Where did you go and what did you do in the Navy?

JK: My first duty station, I was stationed on the U.S.S. Coronado, LPD 11, Vietnam bound. Think about it. But the dude, the chief what had signed the [?] said, “Keaton, you got orders to New Brunswick.” I didn’t know but one Brunswick and that was Georgia. “Yes, yes, I’ll go to Georgia!” But it didn’t happen that way. Instead of GA it was ME [Maine].

GB: What was that like?

JK: Ooooh. I ain’t never been in snow in my life. I never been in snow in my life. And I go, “Man!” That had to push the snow up side the barracks. And the barracks is something like three stories and it’s over halfway up. I go “Man. God.” And it started snowing and I ain’t never been in snow in my life.

GB: What were the people like up there?

JK: They was all different altogether. The accent and the way they talked. It was different. But this eight sixty [?] he gave me a shovel. I never saw a snow shovel in my life. He said, “There’s a sidewalk out there. Go find it.” I said “A what?” “There’s a sidewalk out there – go find it. I want the whole sidewalk shoveled off.” I said, “How many blocks are we talking about?” He said, “Three.” I said “What?” He said, “Three blocks.” I said, “Man, I’m going to be out there for weeks.” He said, “I know.” So as I got the sidewalk all shoveled off, in came the snow blower. Blowed the snow back. I looked at him and said, “Man, I could do something to you to hurt you. It took me three weeks to do this. And it took you 30 minutes to blow all that snow back.” It was a different experience. Maine. I had never been in snow. I’d never been around a lot of people that don’t sound like me. And it was really wild.

GB: How were they different. Were they more respectful?

JK: They were more friendly….

GB: Why did you want to come back here?

JK: Mom.

GB: You leave Mom and you come back to Mom…

JK: Mom.

GB: What kinds of jobs did you do before coming here?

JK: I started working for the village of Homestead. I worked for the Cursios. Well, the Cursios weren’t there at the time. I worked for Ms. Cynthia Cunningham. I started as a maintenance man. Then the condominium wasn’t selling. The dude she working for Greenspan, out of New York, owned a percentage of the buildings and I guess it wasn’t moving fast enough. Then the Cursios. When the Cursios came, it was racist all over again. He brung his crew, he brung his daughter, he brung his dew boy. I go, “We don’t have no babies in this building.” On Mondays when I come in to clean up the guest house I always found babies’ pampers and babies’ food jars. I go, “Ain’t no babies in this building.” The Cursios.

GB: So how did you find out about working here and how did to make the decision about working here. What was that like?

JK: Ok. The main owner of the building, Herb Greenspan. But Cursio blocked him from seeing me. He said, “I want to walk the area. I want to see Julius.” He say, “Well, he’s over with so and so.” Ok, so finally I got a chance to meet Mr. Greenspan and tell him what’s going on and Cursio said, “You’re fired.” I said, “Mr. Greenspan, we need to talk. “ Cursio said, “You’re fired. Get off the property.”

Mr. Greenspan said, “Well, I gotta hear what he got to say.” So when he heard what I had to say, I said, “We don’t have no petty cash. His daughter working here. Mrs. Cunningham was doing a good job. She had so many condominiums that she was selling and I was going to get a $5,000 bonus. But when the Cursios came in they blowed everything.

GB: I meant when you got the job here.

JK: Oh, when I started here? When I first got out I was working for R.A. Getty. Ex-marine. He was powerful. Everybody was a feared of Mr. Getty. My first job here, I used to go on the island. I went on the island for about two weeks. Then he say, “Why you going on the island?” And I say, “That’s what the job description say, work on the island.” He said, “Can you work by yourself?” And I say “I sure can.” And he said, “You don’t have to go on the island no more. You can work here. Matter of fact, I want you to take that guy right there because he goes to the dump and he stays too long.” I say, “Okay.” “Well, he’s going to show you the ropes.” We had this guy named [?] Barnett. He’s the heavy equipment operator. We go to the dump. He leave the dump to go by his girlfriend’s house and then decide to go back to work. And he said, “I want you in his spot.” Well, we had an old Dodge, a standard, two gears. He said, “You know how to drive?” I said, “Yes, sir.” He said, “Do you know how to drive a standard?” I said, “Yes, sir.” He said “Ponder [?] going to show you how to get to the dump.” I said, “Okay.” So we went to the dump. So when I got back he said, “Did he do all right?” He said, [unintelligible]. “Good. He got your job. I want you to do something else.” So I started working here and he started Monday on the island. And I’ve been working here ever since.

GB: So you joined the National Park Service formally as an employee?

JK: Yes. First I was what you call a 180 days appointment, I mean nine months, how can I say it, on a trial basis. So he said, “Well, I like your work so much, I’m going to [?] you. I said, “Fine.” “I like your work so much I’m going to hire you full time.” I say okay. “But, you know, you sometimes get furloughed. You know what that means? You take two months out of the year, you draw unemployment and then you come back. Are you sure you want to do that?” “Yeah, I’m sure.” About one week I come back he said “I don’t want you on furlough. I want you here full time.” I said, “Are you sure you want to do that?” “Yeah, yeah, I depend on you.” “What do you mean by that?” He said “I don’t have to worry about you. I just say what I needed done and you do it.”

GB: Did you ever think of going to another place to work or have you been happy here?

JK: I applied to Guadalupe. I wanted to go to New Mexico. They said I was too young and all this stuff. Then I applied again. Same job. “You too young, you don’t have experience.” I go, “What? I don’t believe this.” You know what, I’m not applying for any more jobs. I’m gonna stay here.

GB: How has your feeling for this place grown in time or changed?

JK: I grew with the change. At first, it was shocking like. All this stuff happening at one time? That’s when Andrew came across. And after that I starting loving it. When they started doing the different landscaping and all that, I loved it.

GB: You got to know a lot more about the flora and fauna?

JK: More about the vegetations, the trees, what to grow, how they grow, when to prune them, when not to prune them. Stuff like that. Loved it.

GB: Can you explain what Hurricane Andrew did to this area?

JK: Ok. Hurricane Andrew, it demolished this area. You had the glass bottomed boat. We had two boats. At the time, they said, “Well, man, you should move your boats. Take them to Miami, take them up and tie them up out of the bay,” which he didn’t do. So one of the boats went into the west mangrove and messed the west mangroves up. That was on the south side. And the boat that was on the north side of the harbor, it flipped it up and it landed upside down. The glass side was up. The boat had completely flipped.

GB: The trees were all down…

JK: The trees down…[?]. End of that road we had to cut different branches of pine to make a path so the assessment team could come here and do their thing.

GB: There were new plants that came in after the hurricane.

JK: All the plants you see now was brought in.

KH: The wild ones in…the Spanish bayonets… you said came in.

GB: The Spanish needles. The Spanish needles. What they did is once they elevated, they brought lots of sod from the outside. They brought in a lot of weeds and stuff with it, different weeds that was never in this park before. The Spanish needles just take over. The morning glory, that was native, we had no morning glory at the time. You got different vines growing in the flower bed that was never here at the time. Now they’re here.

GB: I didn’t ask you before about getting here from the early days and how that’s changed, because there were, I gather, two roads. Could you describe that?

JK: The two roads split right at 167, what you call Farm Life Road. At the time, there was a building, if you all go back towards Homestead, that you see, what you call the buildings in Homestead, it used to set up the canal. And the canal used to go from 162nd all the way out here. Okay. Right on the south side was the white road. On the north side was the black road. That’s where the roads split. Once you got on that road, you went straight out.

GB: You never saw anybody of different color on either road, right?

JK: You saw different cars coming and going but the canal separated a lot of that stuff.

GB: Did you ever see any white folks out in this section?

JK: Yes, because they worked for the county. County employees. They come over and collected the money from the concessionaires, stuff like that. And that was it.

GB: Do you have any memories about the Jones family?

JK: I met Sir Lancelot when I first started working here. Because one day I was out at Adams Key and he came across in his little boat. He said, “Oh, we finally got some colored in this park now.” I started laughing. I said, “What do you mean by that?” “You, I’m talking about you. Let me introduce myself. I’m Sir Lancelot Jones and I live right over there.” Oh yeah, he had a beautiful home. He pointed and showed it to me. “Yeah, I was raised over there.” And I go, “Wow, unbelievable.” And as the years went by, we started seeing him all the time. His favorite ice cream. He loved ice cream. Strawberry ice cream. Walnut ice cream. Any kind of ice cream, he loved it. He said, “when you go home, think about me and eat some ice cream.” And I said, “Yes sir, I’ll eat some ice cream.” You talk about a brilliant man, he was smart. Sir Lancelot was very smart.

GB: So he wasn’t particularly well know in the community then. Is that right?

JK: Only on the reef. Only if you was a fisherman. Yes, he was. And Miami.

GB: Thank you very much. Appreciate it.

JK: No problem…

ENDS